Just an idea..
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08-04-2014 01:18 AM
Post: #1
Just an idea..



Juthoth Offline
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While reading these posts on this forum it occurred to me that many people find(Quite obviously ;D) strong resemblance with ancient cultures of Europe, and with this many cool factions it is understandable that choosing one is no simple matter. So knowledge which faction is "closest" to your own roots could help make decision.

So I had this idea that if game designers could playfully paint map of Europe with colors of factions, it could give some hint of thought process "behind the scenes". I know this might really not be any big decision factor, and that in some cases it is quite obvious, but in my opinion it would be nice to know. Of course I not not expect game designers to know every little detail about every single small country, but even then it might have some weight.

As an example for myself I m from Finland, which can be viewed pretty small on a Europe's scale, with most history unknown, but still if you simply want to put it in some faction a category(if there is any Big Grin, and there does not have to be one of course), I would not be sure where to put it. Nordgard is strong option since much of its culture is highly related to its other nordic neighbours, which view themselves as "Viking" cultures without better term at hand. On the other hand Great love for nature and forests would make me put it in Wyldfolk caste, and yet again strong connections to east such as Russia and other eastern Europe bends towards Troglodytes.(if I have got right picture Smile) Of course peoples other personal preferences weight much more than things like this, but it just came to mind so I wrote it here. Smile

I did not know where to post this, so I brought it here.(Right beside my other post... Big Grin) Hope this also blooms some small conversation. Smile
(This post was last modified: 08-04-2014 01:21 AM by Juthoth.)
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08-04-2014 03:02 AM
Post: #2
RE: Just an idea..



David Offline
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Well I would not be able to do that because there is too much overlapping of different cultures in different times. And there are too many non-synchronous elements and fantasy aspects. For example, I could not point to a country in Europe and say "Beastspawn". Beastspawn are everywhere and do not represent any culture.

Each faction is only very losely based on an ancient culture, and this connection accounts for only about 10% of each faction's true essence. So while Nordgard is "nordic", it consists largely of Dwarves and Ogres as well as other nordic mythological creatures, and the culture could be best understood by the two main influences - the Vaettir Asrae gods and the Vanitan Earth gods. So while the Nordgaard have a viking look, their culture bears only a passing resemblence to viking-age Scandinavia.

That said, the closest analogies would be as follows:

Beastspawn - Monsters of various mythologies (no Location)
Reavers - The Reavers of Tartovara are losely analagous to Germanic tribes of from ancient times, from when they lived on the Eurasian Steppe to the early Dark-Ages. However, Reavers exist in many places across Calydorn, so the Reavers of the Tauran Empire are similar to the Ancient "Sea Peoples" (Sherden, Lukka, Ekwesh etc.). And there are many other Reaver cultures.

Halodynes - Classical Greek including colonies, Thracians, Macedonians and Successor Kingdoms, Phrygia, Lycia, Amazons & Scythians.

Mortans - Early imperial Rome (Augustus to Marcus Aurelius), with some Republican Rome and some late imperial, plus minor influences from Samnites and Etruscans. For Geography imagine the Roman Empire at ist height.

Nordgaard - Nordic, including colonies like Iceland, Vinland, and Varangians.

Troglodytes - Tartharond would be somewhere in the Mediterranean between North Africa, Italy and Spain. The Empire of Dusk would be the Baltic Sea and parts of Scandinavia. the Trogs are not based on any historical culture. Their visual theme is based on Mongol Horde style armor.

Wyldfolk - Celtic, from ancient Eurasian migrants, Hallstatt, and La Tene cultures, through the Gauls, Celtiberians, and Britons, to the Dark Ages Welsh, Irish and Scots, (from 3000 BC to the Dark Ages).

Regarding Finland. Geographically it would be analagous to The Northlands and Nordgaard. Culturally, we have not so far used Finno, Sami or other Finno-Ugric influences for any culture of Ghorn, but it does fit closest to the tribes of northern Zephyr. So too the Slavic cultures and countries.

We could only release 6 factions at the beginning, and we were focussed on classical and ancient cultures. The Finno-Ugric and Sami cultures were not iconic during the Bronze Age. Their cool, iconic apex would be during the Middle Ages (in my opinion). So they were not used as inspiration for any of the cultures on the continent of Ghorn.

In the unpublished geography of Calydorn, the dense coniferous forests of northern Zephyr are home to tribes based on Finn-Ugric culture. These are semi-nomadic, bronze-Age, hunter-gatherer Animists. Animists are People who embrace the life Force of Nature and bind their souls to the Dead Mother Goddes Dhannya. there are Animist cultures all across the world of Calydorn.
In terms of factions, the Tuathan of the Wyldfolk are the only Animists with game stats. The Background also mentions the White Horse Tribes of of the Cephalos Desert, the Tao-Gong of Xandria the Mocatan Totem Tribes of Tonatopa, The HErmetic Paladin Order of Cruithnor (on Zephyr).

The tentative name of these tribes is the Pahjalans. They struggle against the hordes of Beastspawn, some of the various Vagolgan cultures (analagous to Slavic cultures), and the remnants of the fractured Gödermark (the former Blessed Empire of Isenwolff). However, their greatest mutual enemy is Valokh and the undead empire he has spawned in northern-central Zephyr. This force of undeath, consists not merely of undead humans but also undead beasts; even the land itself is cursed with a rotting blight of undeath. Valokh means to kill Nature in order to destroy the divine essence of the dead goddess Dhannya which resides therein.

The Tuathan, Pahjalans and other Animist cultures seek to re-awaken Dhannya and resurrect the dead Goddess. This is being accomplished by expanding the groves where her essence exists and joining these zones by means of a network of megaliths located along the natural Leylines of magical power. It seems Valokh sees this effort as a very real threat to his existence. Valokh is the most powerful deity in the universe by most reckoning. The only comparable forces would be the Urghast and possibly Dhannya (if she were resurrected in some semblence of her former might). And it is questionable if Valokh would be able to match the combined might of the remaining Dawn Gods, for they are alien and enigmatic, and the machinations of these transdimensional super-deities are difficult even for Valokh to comprehend (since he was formed from the shattered souls of 3-dimensional Mortals during the magical apocalypse of the Wu Wei Sorcerers).

But now I am starting to digress, and I guess I answered your questions.
(This post was last modified: 08-04-2014 03:19 AM by David.)
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08-04-2014 02:27 PM
Post: #3
RE: Just an idea..



Juthoth Offline
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Thank you for answering so quickly! Smile As I(at least tried) mentioned in my post it is understandable that Finno-Ugric cultures are not used, since they are not exactly iconic in common myths. It was however nice to read and hear about thought process behind these factions, including unpublished content. This answer as good as it was(Which is quite common for such answers. Wink), it created more questions than it answered. Big Grin

So if you allow me to continue my questions here are some. Smile

1: Will there be factions from other continents, such as wraiht-kings and their armies of the remnants of Gnostic Cabal?

2: After writing my post it came to my mind that there are these threads where you can make suggestions about new units, and as I do not know which faction to put this i thought I'd put it here. In Finnish culture there is a term for person of great wisdom and vast knowledge and understanding, and he is called "Tietäjä", which is probably best translated as Sage, or more roughly "someone who knows". They were elders and rune singers. Wise men among people. Often great warriors also. I know it is more of "iron age content", yet it could be put in use if wanted. Smile Most well used as warlord for some faction/sub-faction.

3: So answer to my "sub-question" is that Finland is either closest to Norgard or Thuathan of the Wyldfolk
(and maybe Troglodytes simply cause part of them are located in right area. Big Grin)?(No reason to make it a big deal however. Smile)

4: I already bought your books as I like to get to know the fluff and rules before I start actual collecting, but will there be more fluff content coming soon, and will it be available in the web or as additional book? So far I like content, and in my own case it is probably mostly whether I get any of my friends interested(and to get enough money on the side of my studies). Smile Keep on good work!

PS: I m using far too many smilies...
(This post was last modified: 08-04-2014 10:55 PM by Juthoth.)
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08-04-2014 11:13 PM
Post: #4
RE: Just an idea..



David Offline
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(08-04-2014 02:27 PM)Juthoth Wrote:  Thank you for answering so quickly! Smile As I(at least tried) mentioned in my post it is understandable that Finno-Ugric cultures are not used, since they are not exactly iconic in common myths. It was however nice to read and hear about thought process behind these factions, including unpublished content. This answer as good as it was(Which is quite common for such answers. Wink), it created more questions than it answered. Big Grin

So if you allow me to continue my questions here are some. Smile

1: Will there be factions from other continents, such as wraiht-kings and their armies of the remnants of Gnostic Cabal?
Yes there will definitely be more factions in the future. Right now we are most focussed on testing and releasing Wave-2, and a series of 3 campaigns. After that will come Wave-3. In order to Launch the next factions we Need to reach a certain critical mass in regular sales, and I guess we are a couple years away from that now. Most likely we will first release the next 4 factions, then perhapos later another 2 or 4. We have plenty of material and already planned the models for the next 6 factions. I won't say exactly which ones will be first, because that could easily Change. If you read the Background book you will see clearly written between the lines the potential candidates for new factions.
Most important right now is supporting the 6 existing factions and speeding up the Releases for those.


2: After writing my post it came to my mind that there are these threads where you can make suggestions about new units, and as I do not know which faction to put this i thought I'd put it here. In Finnish culture there is a term for person of great wisdom and vast knowledge and understanding, and he is called "Tietäjä", which is probably best translated as Sage, or more roughly "someone who knows". They were elders and rune singers. Wise men among people. Often great warriors also. I know it is more of "iron age content", yet it could be put in use if wanted. Smile Most well used as warlord for some faction/sub-faction.
okay, sounds good.

3: So answer to my "sub-question" is that Finland is either closest to Norgard or Thuathan of the Wyldfolk
(and maybe Troglodytes simply cause part of them are located in right area. Big Grin)?(No reason to make it a big deal however. Smile)
Well even Finland itself has had different cultures at different times in different areas, for example the you have Swedish on the west coast, Sami in the North and Finns and Karelians in the south and west. I would say the Finno-Ugric culture matches best to the Animist Pahjahlans of Zephyr.
After that the closets cultural similarity would be the Tuathan of Rilfingen Forest (just North of the Ythkallen Mountains (top right on the map).
Geographically Finland would be most similar to the forested peninsulas east of Nordgaard, but you have to understand that we did not use scandinavian countries as a geograophical template or Inspiration for Nordgaard. The two are utterly different, so such a geographical comparison has really no meaning.

4: I already bought your books as I like to get to know the fluff and rules before I start actual collecting, but will there be more fluff content coming soon, and will it be available in the web or as additional book? So far I like content, and in my own case it is probably mostly whether I get any of my friends interested(and to get enough money on the side of my studies). Smile Keep on good work!
Yes, more fluff is planned. The next would be a full Atlas of ghorn with a pretty extensive section on the other continents. Not sure which Format it will take yet.

PS: I m using far too many smilies...
Dont worry, be happy :-)
(This post was last modified: 08-04-2014 11:18 PM by David.)
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08-05-2014 12:56 AM
Post: #5
RE: Just an idea..



Juthoth Offline
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Thank you again for a swift answer! I hope I get some of my friends to share my interest and then I think I could start buying some figures(what ever faction that will be Big Grin).

As for this sami, mainland finnish and karelian thing I m aware, and basically only thing that really separates Finns from their neighbours is language, and culture it brings with it. As we are all aware ethnic heritage comes from at least 3 sources, which does not need to have anything to do with each other, which are cultural, lingual and genetic, so I m aware of overlapping and other problems this kind of question raises. It is however nice to hear these thoughts in fluff, since as a finnish person I don't really expect Finland or finnic tribes to be mentioned nor used anywhere since they are not really iconic in most fantasy worlds or anywhere else for that matter.(If we don't count Tolkien) Smile

"but you have to understand that we did not use scandinavian countries as a geograophical template or Inspiration for Nordgaard. The two are utterly different, so such a geographical comparison has really no meaning." I really tried to express that these questions are playful and I do not expect anything like direct mach. Just like in good fantasy worlds should be nothing is taken directly unchanged from history and other sources.
As for my PS: too many smilies I meant that I use lot more smilies thank I actually smile. Tongue It simply seems easy to make conversation on notes happier and more lifelike.

I think this case is settled then. Thank you for all your answers, and hopefully something I said might also turn fruitful! Smile
(This post was last modified: 08-05-2014 01:01 AM by Juthoth.)
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08-06-2014 01:15 AM
Post: #6
RE: Just an idea..



David Offline
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No Problem.
Glad I could answer your questions.
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